TeleFinder Chat Log

TeleFinder Chat from Tuesday, August 18, 1998 11 AM PDT.

In attendance:

From Spider Island: Rusty Tucker

Sysops: Mikael Fredriksson, Jim Smith, Jim Leary, Ken Sutherland, Bob Nunn, Daniel O'Leary, Donald McHose,

Rusty Tucker hola!
Mikael Fredriksson joined the chat.
Rusty Tucker Welcome to the chat mikael!
Mikael Fredriksson : Hi!
Rusty Tucker hi
Rusty Tucker the server crashed just as I was getting on last time, looks like OT freaked out
Mikael Fredriksson : Any TF news?
Mikael Fredriksson : ok
Rusty Tucker nothing new here, I just got back from a week off
Jim Smith joined the chat.
Rusty Tucker Welcome to the chat Jim!
Ken Sutherland joined the chat.
Rusty Tucker Welcome to the chat Ken!
Jim Leary joined the chat.
Rusty Tucker Welcome to the chat Jim!
Ken Sutherland : Hi All
Mikael Fredriksson : HI
Ken Sutherland : So RT, when are we going to c fc 5.7?
Rusty Tucker just a sec
Jim Leary : Thanks Ken for the help. I faxed for the purchase yesterday
Ken Sutherland : great, thanks
Ken Sutherland : Mr. Smith, I'm in need of your help, still cant get news working
Bob Nunn joined the chat.
Rusty Tucker Welcome to the chat Bob!
Ken Sutherland : Hi Bob
Bob Nunn : Hey Sorry I'm Late
Ken Sutherland : 100 lines, must not be late, must stop using Microsoft timetable
Jim Leary : Hey, my boss just handed me an order form for "Mac OS 8 Web Server Cookbook" Anyone ever hear of it?
Ken Sutherland : nope, sounds interesting
Jim Leary : In the preview, it says it will show you how to "install and configure server software including several different Web Servers" Is TeleFinder Server included?
Jim Leary : Rusty....ever hear of this book?
Ken Sutherland : ask another ?
Rusty Tucker just a sec
Ken Sutherland : anyone tried to get FireSite working?
Bob Nunn : Mac OS 8 Web Server Cookbook by Phil Bourne, David Hart List Price: $39.95 Our Price: $31.96 You Save: $7.99 (20%) Paperback - 450 pages (August 1998) Prentice Hall Computer Books; ISBN: 0135200164 Not Yet Available: You may still order this title. We will ship it to you when it is released by the publisher.
Ken Sutherland : why is it we never c TF web server mentioned in web site docs
Ken Sutherland : iv been trying to get FireSite setup, it docs WebStar but not TF
Ken Sutherland : RT, latest MS, I have probs sending email with large files >100K, sending at about 3-5k/s, if I send to my secondary mailserver EIMS I get >130K/s with the same file
Bob Nunn : You will have to help me on why you would want FireSite. I do what it is supposed to do now, I have my graphic files on my ISP's server for the company. I am not sure that it is any faster than the built in cache though.
Jim Leary : why Ken? The 64,000 dollar question and why when I went to MacWorld and asked 5 people/"experts" about TF did 4 look at me like I landed from Mars and the other say "I thought they went out of business a year ago
Jim Leary : "
Ken Sutherland : hahaha, oops, that's not funny really
Jim Leary : sure it is
Jim Leary : Maybe if TF was what all of you praise it to be...someone out there would know about it
Bob Nunn : Like everything else. Everyone remembers that QuicKen stopped production of its Mac product, not the release stating the made a mistake and are now supporting it again.
Jim Leary : When TF reaches its true potential ...people will know about it
Ken Sutherland : maybe if people stopped knocking it , it would help
Jim Leary : Maybe if it supported needs, people wouldn't knock it
Ken Sutherland : ok, ill give you that, btw, are you related to Ivan Good? (its a joke)
Bob Nunn : Well you always have to compare any product to its competitors and their services.
Jim Leary : instead of focusing on silly things like chats it should have professional, easy to use and fast searches for instance...don't get me started...I can go on and on about this one
Ken Sutherland : hahahahahahhha
Ken Sutherland : you do have a valid point
Rusty Tucker hey - I'm back
Jim Leary : TF has tremendous potential...there's no question about it...reaching it is another subject
Rusty Tucker Ken, why don't you talk to the FireSite guys about setup questions?
Ken Sutherland : will do, just thought you power hungry Yanks would have tried it before us poor Brits
Bob Nunn : RT what are the major benefits that fireside would provide. I didn't see that many advantages?
Ken Sutherland : speed
Bob Nunn : But keeping your graphics on your ISP server is a link thing and that is not a big deal. You can easily link your graphics yourself.
Ken Sutherland : the trick it , it does it for you without any help
Ken Sutherland : also it can spread around multiple ftp site, spreading load
Bob Nunn : I can see where that would be helpful.
Rusty Tucker right, FireSite lets you run your HTML off your 288 modem, graphics from your ISP
Rusty Tucker AKA "The Rubber-ChicKen" method. Its something that Russ Reynaga started doing years ago manually.
Ken Sutherland : set this up with DNS pro and load balancing could give great results
Rusty Tucker If you have a very large site, FireSite will automate the details to some degree.
Bob Nunn : So does a search and replace
Rusty Tucker More or less, on the fly
Ken Sutherland : RT, mentioned to ask is there any way of getting list of users with web sites?
Rusty Tucker Suzie?
Rusty Tucker Although you'll probably need to tweak the source to generate a proper URL
Daniel O'Leary joined the chat.
Rusty Tucker Welcome to the chat Daniel!
Ken Sutherland : oh shit, here comes trouble
Daniel O'Leary : Sorry I'm late.
Ken Sutherland : 8-)
Daniel O'Leary : hahahaha
Daniel O'Leary : only for you Ken.
Bob Nunn : We were waiting until you got here to talk bad about NT and Frontpage.
Rusty Tucker For FireSite, you need to have an ISP that will let you run graphics links off their server, that is not free, its available at "co-location" type prices.
Daniel O'Leary : Rusty, I got your message regarding the client.
Rusty Tucker -- no MS talk to day, please!
Ken Sutherland : rumor has it MS has bought Norton utilities
Rusty Tucker good, did it work?
Daniel O'Leary : Please change that behavior... Don't know.
Ken Sutherland : they HAVE sold it, wont say who tho
Rusty Tucker Dan's talking about the offline posting putting in the "Guest" name sometimes.
Daniel O'Leary : It does it every time for me.
Rusty Tucker hmm, you know that's even stranger now that I think of it.
Donald McHose joined the chat.
Rusty Tucker Welcome to the chat Donald!
Rusty Tucker TeleFinder Server is supposed to replace the supplied name with the users logon name anyway
Daniel O'Leary : Client used to adopt the last used settings file.
Rusty Tucker no, always the "Open" settings file
Daniel O'Leary : Where in the world is it getting GUEST from.
Daniel O'Leary : That is not and has never been my "default".
Rusty Tucker maybe the prefs file, or application resfile
Daniel O'Leary : I know for certain that it will do it again if I close TF user now and post to something locally.
Rusty Tucker in any event, the server should replace the name with the login name
Rusty Tucker the posting with "Guest" I see, was that originally posted to your server or mine?
Daniel O'Leary : How does it know what that is when you are not connected?
Daniel O'Leary : Posted from mine.
Daniel O'Leary : I am sure that off-line posted adopted "last used" preferences for name.
Daniel O'Leary : I use that too often.
Daniel O'Leary : I made the mistake of posting as a test user once.
Ken Sutherland : I bet the PC users would like to do offline posting, pity its not available
Rusty Tucker I think that it used to be that a prefs file was -always- open, that is not the case now.
Daniel O'Leary : Please fix it (grin)
Ken Sutherland : pleas add it, sob
Rusty Tucker please login to post :)
Daniel O'Leary : AHHHHHHHHHHHRRRRRRRGGGGGGH
Rusty Tucker The direct posting to Topic files -is- a bit of a hack I'm afraid.
Daniel O'Leary : I like offline posting. I'll bet that TF/User topic subscriptions must be hosed to then.
Ken Sutherland : u mean custom coding
Daniel O'Leary : maybe so but it used to work.
Rusty Tucker KS - you're talking about "Topic Subscriptions" which is different from direct posting to files as DO is describing.
Daniel O'Leary : I was RT>
Ken Sutherland : o yeh, PC users would luv to read offline topics
Rusty Tucker DO- no, on subscriptions, which is what I though you originally meant, the "login" name is used as the "from" address.
Daniel O'Leary : But wondering what happens when a user attempts a subscription posting offline.
Ken Sutherland : , want me to talk about MS instead
Daniel O'Leary : hahahaha
Rusty Tucker whatever was originally there is replaced with the real login name
Daniel O'Leary : uhoh... an if multiple folks share a copy of TF/User with different settings files?
Rusty Tucker Bon N. - Brian Akey reports "no GPFs" using TeleFinder 4.0b3 ! yee ha!
Ken Sutherland : RT, re CARBON, have u tested for compatibility?, just interested
Daniel O'Leary : the topic updates if any are assigned to potentially the wrong user.
Rusty Tucker yes, and posted them somewhere too
Bob Nunn : I asked him to thrash it. Not many of my friends are on PCs. Glad to help.
Rusty Tucker I think on the "www.spiderisland.com/fatw/" page
Rusty Tucker thanks!
Ken Sutherland : RT, latest MS, I have probs sending email with large files >100K, sending at about 3-5k/s, if I send to my secondary mailserver EIMS I get >130K/s with the same file
Rusty Tucker Just hope that you're not dependent on CTB Connection Tools for ISDN, cause they are history.
Bob Nunn : Of course his machine is likely optimally configured etc. That's the problem with getting MIS types to try stuff. Now if I could get my wife to set it up and use it over an AOL connection.
Rusty Tucker Is that an Ethernet connection in both cases, or ISDN?
Rusty Tucker not sure exactly what you are telling me
Daniel O'Leary : I have a PC user on ether here.
Rusty Tucker Ken S
Ken Sutherland : Ethernet, my 9600 downstairs to a 7600 upstairs
Daniel O'Leary : He can only connect once.
Daniel O'Leary : then the modem lights here for xmit and rcv start an endless dance.
Daniel O'Leary : He's connecting through ether to a router CPU which is on the net via PPP.
Rusty Tucker You need to tell me exactly what you're doing and measuring Ken.
Rusty Tucker DO, is that w/ 4.0b3?
Daniel O'Leary : just a sec...
Rusty Tucker I don't' find any probs connecting , disconnecting, and reconnecting here.
Daniel O'Leary : yes.
Daniel O'Leary : it was b3.
Daniel O'Leary : Had LoseNT on it..
Donald McHose left the chat.
Rusty Tucker c-ya Donald McHose
Rusty Tucker might try again to see what's up there.
Rusty Tucker I can't right now cuz all nodes are full.
Daniel O'Leary : I see the login name and password successful indications, then the dance of the LED's.
Ken Sutherland : does anyone have Aztec's really old ascii patch for TF server
Rusty Tucker isn't that that Irish thing? :)
Daniel O'Leary : I ?????
Ken Sutherland : .
Rusty Tucker hmm, no problem here DO.
Ken Sutherland : I am expecting some PC users in very near future, the Aztec ascii patch mad it really obvious how to get PC client instead of ascii terminal, anyone got it
Rusty Tucker what corrects it, an NT reboot?
Daniel O'Leary : I do not know RT. I only see a successful connection when he reinstalls TF client.
Daniel O'Leary : One shot.
Rusty Tucker weird
Bob Nunn : If it was a Mac I would say it was trashing the prefs file.
Jim Smith left the chat.
Rusty Tucker c-ya Jim Smith
Rusty Tucker any last questions before I grab some lunch?
Bob Nunn : Please send the log. CYA Thur.?
Daniel O'Leary : Not today... been too busy at work...
Rusty Tucker ya bet
Bob Nunn left the chat.
Rusty Tucker c-ya Bob Nunn
Daniel O'Leary : RT I have one.
Rusty Tucker go ahead
Daniel O'Leary : I retried PPP today... looks like the servers still don't come back after disconnect.
Rusty Tucker ?
Rusty Tucker retired what PPP?
Daniel O'Leary : I get a -3xxx error.
Daniel O'Leary : Yes, PPP vs. VIG.
Rusty Tucker where?
Daniel O'Leary : On my system.
Rusty Tucker on what part of your system?
Rusty Tucker that sounds like some kind of AppleTalk error?
Daniel O'Leary : main server.
Daniel O'Leary : saw it in the web logs.
Rusty Tucker or OT error, ok in the web
Rusty Tucker did PPP know that it was offline?
Ken Sutherland : night
Daniel O'Leary : After that it appears that none was able to contact the system.
Ken Sutherland left the chat.
Rusty Tucker c-ya Ken Sutherland
Rusty Tucker or only the modems were offline?
Daniel O'Leary : I do not think so... Have seem both cases.
Rusty Tucker PPP ( apples ) is not good at knowing its offline.
Daniel O'Leary : where modems have CD and where they are not active.
Rusty Tucker If it is not offline, then there's no way for TeleFinder to know that PPP is no good.
Daniel O'Leary : ping check?
Rusty Tucker If CD is active and no activity, then the modem is crashed, usually.
Daniel O'Leary : would think a ping to the upstream gate would find that.
Rusty Tucker ping failure could mean several things, not necessarily that the PPP connection is dead, the PPP client is _supposed_ to know that and report it.
Daniel O'Leary : then pull the plug on DTR?
Daniel O'Leary : I have not tried the later versions of anything other than OT PPP.
Rusty Tucker The thing that I have seen most is PPP does not notice that carrier is lost, and doesn't seem to care.
Daniel O'Leary : That is a simple thing to detect too.
Daniel O'Leary : It's in the hardware.
Rusty Tucker yes, TeleFinder has done it for a very long time
Rusty Tucker no, its done it software usually, not all the hardware supports CD
Rusty Tucker nor do all modem cables wire it thru
Rusty Tucker see ya Thurs.!
Daniel O'Leary : Every serial port chip I ever designed with had CD.
Daniel O'Leary : Catcha later...
Daniel O'Leary left the chat.
Rusty Tucker c-ya Daniel O'Leary
Jim Leary left the chat.
Rusty Tucker c-ya Jim Leary
Mikael Fredriksson left the chat.
Rusty Tucker c-ya Mikael Fredriksson