---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Text of TeleFinder Chat from Tuesday, December 2, 1997 11 AM PST. In attendance: From Spider Island: Rusty Tucker, Sysops: Bob Nunn, Jim Smith, Kevin Shearon, Bob Wright, Bill Gram-Reefer, Jim Leary, Dick Grable, mikael fredriksson, Daniel Raguse, Ken Sutherland ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- mikael fredriksson: <> chat logger: <> Rusty Tucker: <> Rusty Tucker: hola! Bob Nunn: <> Rusty Tucker: Hi Bob Bob Nunn: Hey, Jim Smith: <> Bob Nunn: Got a quick one before the room gets crowded. I need my ports to reset more frequently on both modem and OT what do I set them at? Kevin Shearon: <> Rusty Tucker: Its in the Node Options Bob Nunn: Yes what is a good setting? Mine have been changed over time from original Rusty Tucker: Reset Interval, I use -1 ( never ) for TCP-IP, and 15 minutes for Modem Bob Nunn: Okay if TCP drops and reconnects what happens to those ports? Rusty Tucker: u mean PPP drops and reconnects? Rusty Tucker: if you're routers connection drops and reconnects, all is well Bob Nunn: Kinda. I think (modem ppp connect) that it kind of drops out or something. The ports don't reset like they should. I can kill and restart TFS and it is okay. Rusty Tucker: that's because the local connection is Ethernet, and that's unaffected Rusty Tucker: if the PPP connect drops, the listening ports are Dead Rusty Tucker: you need to reset the servers (quit and restart ) Bob Nunn: Still don't have my router installed. Bell South is having trouble in my neighborhood. Sent my job to the engineering department. Bob Nunn: The system still shows hooked up etc. I can launch user and use the connect it just hangs the server ports and sometimes the web server Bob Nunn: That is why I was asking about resetting the TCPIP ports instead of -1 Rusty Tucker: You need to use something like the PPP monitor in OAT and re-launch TF . Bob Wright: <> Rusty Tucker: Are there any outstanding Bugs I need to look at before release of 5.6? Rusty Tucker: The Windows User is ready to roll, unless there are any show stoppers Rusty Tucker: ditto the Mac s/w Bob Nunn: I would like to be able to remotely reset the web server. I haven't had any problems except that one and it has been like that for a while. Bill Gram-Reefer: <> Rusty Tucker: BN - U can do that via Frontier or Apple Script Bill Gram-Reefer: delighted Rusty Tucker: Hola BGR! Bob Nunn: Thanks I will think on that. Rusty Tucker: BN- on the Nodes, you need to stop all, then reset them Rusty Tucker: the "listener" is not released until all Listening Threads have stopped/ Bob Wright: is there a way to make multiple address books for one machine? Rusty Tucker: All Threads on the same port share a common listener under OT Bob Nunn: Yep I know that works. I remotely restart the whole thing. It seems a shame that I have to completely restart when the modem ports still work and the system is still up. I understand though. The router hopefully will stop this. Rusty Tucker: BW- only by duplicating the TF Folder. Rusty Tucker: Yes, the router will stop that for sure Rusty Tucker: Any Bugs with the latest TF Server or Mail Server? Bob Wright: RT: any chance of being able to do that in future versions? Rusty Tucker: probably not. Bill Gram-Reefer: FYI, just got an announcement from WebStar re plug-in from Sophisticated Circuits that restarts computer if it thinks W* has crashed. Jim Leary: <> Rusty Tucker: Hi Jim! Jim Leary: Hello...still talking to me Bob Wright: I just figured since you could load different settings you should be able to load various address books.... Rusty Tucker: Sure, as long as you're not flaming the BBS Guests Bob Wright: makes it hard in schools where all machines are public to have ONE address book Rusty Tucker: I understand. Jim Leary: Rusty, Dan O has gotten me to the point of displaying the BBS in list form with document icons. The next obstacle is displaying those as thumbnails of the pics. any progress in that direction? Bill Gram-Reefer: So the new TF User for WIN supports drag and drop? Cewel Rusty Tucker: There's many issues involved, the TF Client is essentially single-user, and MacOS doesn't have any multi-user support or security Bob Wright: How hard would it be to at least allow the TF client to look for an address book file which called something other than "Address Book"? Rusty Tucker: The D & D is one way, drag from Explorer/File Manager Rusty Tucker: brb Bill Gram-Reefer: got to crawl before you run Bob Nunn: Do many of you run web servers? Bill Gram-Reefer: yes mikael fredriksson: Yes Bob Wright: yep Kevin Shearon: Does anyone use Adobe PageMaker? Bob Nunn: Yep Rusty Tucker: :) Kevin Shearon: Does anyone use Adobe PageMaker? Bill Gram-Reefer: nope Bob Nunn: Yep for a living. Rusty Tucker: BW- there's a lot of other issues for multi-user besides a separate address book Rusty Tucker: You'd really need password protection of the data, download paths, password protection, separate modem setups and so on Bill Gram-Reefer: KS-why do you ask about PageMaker? Kevin Shearon: BN-I need to import a pdf file into PageMaker Bob Wright: download paths? I don't understand what that has to do with offering multiple address books. Kevin Shearon: or I should say one of our newspapers needs to, I use Quark. We sent then\m an ad electronically and they want to have full pagination Kevin Shearon: I know that PageMaker can import pdf files like a common graphic but they can't get it to work Bill Gram-Reefer: comp.publish.prepress is probably the best newsgroup to find out. There are also some PDF websites Jim Leary: KS. Do you know where I can get Quark at a discount? Can't dish out $700 Bob Nunn: I 've never done that Kevin sorry. Don't like or use Quark. Dick Grable: <> Kevin Shearon: I'll send you my copy if the price is right Jim Leary: which is? Kevin Shearon: lets start the bidding at $250 US Bob Wright: brb Bill Gram-Reefer: I think if you have distiller you can change the pdf file into something more compatible Rusty Tucker: In PM 6.5 you can save as PDF, but it does not seem to open PDF Jim Leary: what version KS? Bob Nunn: It would seem to me that you would end up reworking the file even it you could import. I have a quark to PageMaker converter by the way. Kevin Shearon: RT-I'm sure at the Calgary NACT the adobe guy said it could be imported Kevin Shearon: JL 3.32 ordering 4.0 in the next week Bob Nunn: He was probably a salesman though. Bill Gram-Reefer: mikael fredriksson: There will be a upgrade to PM6.5 now in December to support PDF placement in documents Jim Leary: So if you have 4.0, your 3.32 will sit on the shelf. How about a better bid Kevin Shearon: he has version 6.0, MK-so it's version 6.5 that is capable of doing this? Bill Gram-Reefer: why not take the Price is Right offline guys Kevin Shearon: JL-email me at "sysop@ocna.org" to discuss this Rusty Tucker: 6.0 needed the Acro "print driver" to save as PDF, not so with 6.5 Kevin Shearon: don't need to save as pdf, rather import a pdf file like a graphic Bill Gram-Reefer: SO Rusty, has the fellow from England settled on the final feature set for his plug-in discussed here sometime ago? mikael fredriksson: There will be a upgrade to PM to anew 6.5.x Bob Nunn: I am already using 6.5.2 Rusty Tucker: "Acquire" may work, but for now it just crashes :( mikael fredriksson: (6.5.3) Bill Gram-Reefer: the wrath of god? Rusty Tucker: I have not heard much news re: the Mail-PI Rusty Tucker: that is too bad, I really think its a neat prod. Bob Nunn: Jon told me .5 was coming out soon. Still in beta. Bob Nunn: Last server upgrade makes it not able to post. Rusty Tucker: ?? Bob Nunn: Beats me. Worked okay until I went to b8? Kevin Shearon: sorry phone call, ok, I'll tell him it's 6.5.3 PageMaker Daniel Raguse: <> Rusty Tucker: you can't send mail now with the mail pi? Bob Nunn: It brings up the header but doesn't finish drawing the page. Dick Grable: <> Bill Gram-Reefer: Hi Daniel Kevin Shearon: my HDS mail pi works very well, if he adds the feature to see files in the mailbox not just attachments it will be very good Bob Nunn: U using 9.4 and the latest server? Rusty Tucker: I still don't understand Daniel Raguse: greetings Rusty Tucker: where do you find the rev? ( URL ?) Bob Nunn: Kevin are you using 9b4? Kevin Shearon: I have .9bd plug in and TF server5.6b8 Kevin Shearon: .9b5 that is Bob Nunn: So you have a later one. Do you know if 9b4 worked okay with b8TFS? Kevin Shearon: I started at b2 or something and never really experienced any problems Kevin Shearon: only problem is to re-register every month before it expires Rusty Tucker: I have b5 Rusty Tucker: it seems to work OK Ken Sutherland: <> Bob Nunn: Mine expired and I got new number. Didn't realize b5 was available. Kevin Shearon: I look at the html coding to try and get it to see files in mailboxes not just attachments, but no luck, any ideas Rusty? Rusty Tucker: Last Chance or forever hold your peace... Rusty Tucker: Any bugs in TF Server or Mail Server, or should we go gold? Kevin Shearon: platinum Ken Sutherland: nope Kevin Shearon: platinum mikael fredriksson: works ok here :) Rusty Tucker: Good! Rusty Tucker: It's been a champ here too, MS has not crashed since the last rev, Bob Nunn: Oh well guess I will re-install. Perhaps it is b5 I have up and just got mixed up. Rusty Tucker: and TF Server since before that Rusty Tucker: KS that's something that Jon will need OT program into the plug-in ( files ) Bill Gram-Reefer: Next week then for 5.6? Jim Leary: As I said before, Rusty, I'm wondering if there is any progress in automatically generating thumbnails for pics for my BBS in place of those document icons next to the files??? Rusty Tucker: I'll make a GM for this week Rusty Tucker: I though you were working with Jon on that Jim? Bob Wright: bak Ken Sutherland: why Rusty, i have several questions but am busy for next 10 mins Bob Nunn: Bob W. You are not available for private chat Bill Gram-Reefer: so what's on tap after 5.6? Ken Sutherland: who needs kids Rusty Tucker: that's why they invented email :) Bill Gram-Reefer: I'll take 2 Bob Wright: BN: sorry Bob Wright: BN; I am now Jim Leary: I haven't heard from him in a while. Time is running out. I'm so close, but need those thumbnails! Bob Wright: I usually keep it off because the kids PSST me all day long Rusty Tucker: Ring him up, put some $ in his pocket, and I'm sure he'll be able to finish that project for you :) Bob Wright: Does anyone know when HDS is going to be released? Jim Leary: I thought you were working on a new server beta that would solve the problem and generate those thumbnails???? Kevin Shearon: Jon told me anytime Rusty Tucker: I made the change that Jon required the in last beta (b8) Jim Leary: what change was that? Rusty Tucker: Jon needed encoding on the FILENAME var in the #dir_list command. Ken Sutherland: <> Rusty Tucker: It was a small change. Jim Leary: Whatever that is, Dan was under the impression that you were working on something to solve the problem within the Server program Bob Wright: any ideas for HDS? Rusty Tucker: According to what I heard in the chat here, he was pretty close on the code to make thumbnail GIFs on the fly using a plug-in Rusty Tucker: ( Jon Paisley ) Jim Leary: He has disappeared lately, must be busy. As you see, he's not here either Bob Wright: I guess on Dec 4 I will just lose email via web services.....that's why I hate to put trust into third parties Rusty Tucker: You should ring him up, or email him, and offer him some $. Rusty Tucker: Everyone has time for $ :) Bob Nunn: Do you still have the tfemail.acgi ? Keep it running as an alternative and change your URLs. Bob Wright: I have written him THREE times...no response. Jim Leary: I'm already doing much of the work on this project on my own time. I can handle that, but I'm not going to pay for a project that is not my personal deal. I work for someone. Jon gave me the impression that this was a challenge he wanted to take on. $$$ w Rusty Tucker: Well, that's between you an Jon then. Ken Sutherland: <> Bill Gram-Reefer: I liked the question so much, I'm gonna ask it again...what's on tap after 5.6? Rusty Tucker: :) Rusty Tucker: missed that one Rusty Tucker: I'm not sure yet ! mikael fredriksson: 5.7? Jim Leary: Does that mean, from your end, there is nothing else that can be done? Ken Sutherland: that's better ...... Rusty do you use the monitor app Bill Gram-Reefer: I have FM Pro 4 and will try to launch a DB using it sometime soon...anyone have any experience with it in this area? Rusty Tucker: JL, in regards to the Thumb to GIF conversion, no. Bob Nunn: Our MIS guy here at Wang's has our dbases set up on FM4 Bill Gram-Reefer: MK--very funny! Bob Nunn: We were using Lasso before. Bill Gram-Reefer: so no probs, easy as pie, my grandma could do it? Bob Wright: I use lasso now and I think its nice with version FM3.0 Bob Nunn: He said something about setting the ports on FM4 and changing the tags. He also says my Lasso will work as is with FM4 so you could leave it if you wanted. Ken Sutherland: Rusty, why does mail server and user manager both take about 14% system load, what is user manager doing that NEEDS 14%, ms drops to 3% if i kill smtp services Ken Sutherland: tf server used to take about 79%, now its down to 67% on average Rusty Tucker: I usually see UM at about 1% Ken Sutherland: finder takes 2%, oat maxes at 6%, kennel (who cares) Rusty Tucker: the loading is decided by the OS, there's not a lot you can do to control it Bob Nunn: Do you run more than stock ram settings on UM? Rusty Tucker: the Front app gets a bunch of time no matter what Rusty Tucker: UM, MS and TF all tell the OS they don't need idle time if they're not doing anything Ken Sutherland: we managed to control the load our app demanded, why is UM at 14%, it only responds to server and ms questions, and at this time nobody is online Rusty Tucker: if users are online, TF wants as much idle time as it can get Ken Sutherland: very true, in the past it averaged at 79% Rusty Tucker: maybe some PI or App is talking to UM Ken Sutherland: but with 5.6 it has reduced due to the increase load from ms and UM Kevin Shearon: <> Rusty Tucker: or maybe the OS version you're running balances the loads differently Ken Sutherland: if i kill tcp tasks all goed back to what i have seen in the past Ken Sutherland: OS8 Ken Sutherland: OT1.2 Bill Gram-Reefer: Any chance to get access to TF Chat Room via browser or is that just impossible? Rusty Tucker: but 5.6 doesn't ask for any more time than before, or any differently than before Rusty Tucker: so it must be OS8 or OT1.2 or a new PI you're running Ken Sutherland: well I'm sorry but at my end if i run good old 5.5 and i put up with the type 2 errors it is a lot better Jim Leary: <> Daniel Raguse: <> Rusty Tucker: Its not impossible, it requires a Java applet to create the User side Ken Sutherland: is there any standard bench we can do? Rusty Tucker: ( chat that is ) Ken Sutherland: if i have tcp processes running 288k modems can only get 2.7k transfer instead of 3.3k Ken Sutherland: SOMETHING is causing a load and i cant find the fu**er Ken Sutherland: (grin) Ken Sutherland: (sob) Ken Sutherland: (sob) mikael fredriksson: Why not true without the plugins? Rusty Tucker: that (tcp) is probably caused by changes in OT 1.2 Rusty Tucker: did you try an earlier UM? Ken Sutherland: can i force replace 1.12 or run 1.3b8 Bob Nunn: Do you think 1.3 will be better or worse. Ken Sutherland: err no, using release with server 5.6b8 Rusty Tucker: 5.5? Ken Sutherland: the new UM as included in the 5.6b8 beta Rusty Tucker: maybe it has something to do with the Code Warrior support in 5.5's UM Bill Gram-Reefer: Lunchtime! OK kids, you're on your own. Bill Gram-Reefer: <> Ken Sutherland: its driving me nuts Ken Sutherland: all i want is a bbs that reports when i connect above 288 and give between 3.2 and 3.4k Ken Sutherland: anyone got the number for first class mikael fredriksson: 112? Jim Smith: KS: want my box of FC:) Rusty Tucker: Hey, guess what Ken Sutherland: does it have a future ? Rusty Tucker: it looks like UM isn't setting it's Idle time when its in the BG Rusty Tucker: that would explain it not going down to 1 or 2% in the BG Ken Sutherland: BG\ Rusty Tucker: but its been that way since early 5.5 betas... Rusty Tucker: so I doubt that its causing your performance changes Ken Sutherland: hmmm Ken Sutherland: is that a Chris phrase i hear Ken Sutherland: what about the mail server and incomplete mail transfer via tcp, did you fix that Jim Smith: <> Rusty Tucker: yep the last b fixed it, its in the notes Ken Sutherland: oops Bob Nunn: Gotta get back to it. Drop me the chat log. thanks Rusty Tucker: see ya Bob Wright: looks at Bnand yells ;-0 Ken Sutherland: ok, what about the server modem report bug then Ken Sutherland: hehe, I'm in a bad mood, time to nag Ken Sutherland: or the secret bill gates message if you hold down the correct key sequence Rusty Tucker: plz send me an Activity log for that Rusty Tucker: I don't see anything that would cause it Rusty Tucker: you don't put a MDM# rez in any of your settings files or prefs file do you? Rusty Tucker: I'm putting a new UM in your box right now Rusty Tucker: check it out w/ Monitor Ken Sutherland: nope, time for food, sorry to bug you Rusty but if i don't you will never be able to sleep at night thinking of all those teeny weenie bugs Ken Sutherland: kiss kiss Rusty Tucker: has anyone else seen that reporting glitch? Ken Sutherland: why does ms jump from 3% to 12% just by adding smtp Ken Sutherland: i run a 180 mhz 603, should have more that enough power Rusty Tucker: don't know Ken Sutherland: is there any way to limit load app load Ken Sutherland: we did 8-) Rusty Tucker: If we had preemptive multitasking we would need to worry about it Rusty Tucker: err: wouldn't Ken Sutherland: have you tried dr1 yet, i just got my new video card today and am about to whip my CD out Rusty Tucker: nope, just put OS8.1 on Rusty Tucker: Dr2 is coming soon w/ Blue Box, that should be more interesting anyway mikael fredriksson: did you get HFS+ to work? Rusty Tucker: Yes, "Erase" was the trick Rusty Tucker: My dev files went from 1G to like 300k! Rusty Tucker: 300 M! mikael fredriksson: :-) Rusty Tucker: very nice! Rusty Tucker: Mail Server will love it! Bob Wright: I need to head out Rusty Tucker: c ya Bob Wright: enjoyed the chat, but I have some training to give Rusty Tucker: Give till it hurts! Bob Wright: haha Bob Wright: laterz! Bob Wright: <> Rusty Tucker: Ken, do you have a v 5.5 TFS app handy? Ken Sutherland: <> mikael fredriksson: maybe its time to put 8.1 on the bbs.. (I use it on my work computer) Rusty Tucker: I have found on eprobl w/ 8.1 Rusty Tucker: it no longer working with PCMacLan Rusty Tucker: Finder locks up when doing file copies mikael fredriksson: update time... ? Rusty Tucker: at least from Drive C to my HD Rusty Tucker: worked OK w/ 8.0 Rusty Tucker: I need to check the web site to see if they have a patch yet Rusty Tucker: it would be nice if Apple would supply a non-destructive HFS+ formatting tool Rusty Tucker: At WinNT could make an NT vol w/0 data loss Rusty Tucker: its going to be tough to convert my mail volumes other wise mikael fredriksson: maybe some think for the HDT people? Rusty Tucker: Its a definite opportunity for some one Rusty Tucker: well time for lunch mikael fredriksson: Bye! Rusty Tucker: bye! ------------------------------------------------------------------ December 2, 1997 -- �Copyright 1997, Spider Island Software